Is Pierre Spies (South Africa, Bulls) the best number 8 of all time?

Pierre Spies is a fantastic player, and a good candidate for the best #8 in the world currently. And I'll happily concede that while So'oialo's damn good (he plays for my province) he just doesn't have the physical presence of Spies in my opinion.

And as impressive that Italian guy is, he's not in the same league as these guys. Sorry.

Best ever? can you say that about ANY #8 ever? what about players like Lofty Nel? Wayne Shelford? Zinzan Brooke or George Smith around 2002-5? Different era's, different standards, all we can do is project talent.

I think the finest #8 I ever saw in terms of raw talent was Filo Tiatia who played #8 for Wellington and the Western Suburbs club throughout the 1990's. Due to politics in NZ rugby and poor luck with injuries he only played two tests for the All Blacks when he was almost 30! But he was recognised as the best #8 in New Zealand by all but the most one-eyed supporters of Wellington's rival Canterbury.

Apparently he's now earning his money playing for Osprey's or something, but he's 37 so he can't be the game-breaker he was.

No Parisse and Rodney So'oialo are both better than him they are all of the above but have a greater presence on the pitch than him,

if parisse played for the all blacks or the springboks hed be regarded as the best player in the world

Yeah, he's been brilliant in this years Super 14.

I hope he'll be on form and playing against the Lions this summer.

I'm surprised to hear you've been seeing him for a while now.

I had no idea he was gay.

he is a great player but he isn't even the best 8 in the world right now

that is Italy's Sergio Parisse (awesome player)

ya